Hashing It Out
Hashing It Out

Episode 130 · 1 month ago

Hashing It Out Personals: Dee Ferguson

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this Hashing It Out Personals episode, we flip the script and talk to Hashing It Out host, Dee Ferguson.

You can also watch on YouTube.

M hm hi. Welcome to the podcast Hashing It Out Personals. I'm here with d Ferguson. I D, how's it going? What's going on? Jesse like it's going, it's going. I'd like you to tell me a little bit about yourself. I want you to go way back, like childhood days. I want you to talk about who you were. Mm hmm, Okay, that's deep. Just get going, just get dry. Um well, i'd have to imagine that because of the amount of energy that I harness on a daily basis, I was conceived in the throes of passion, right. I'm pretty sure my mom and dad had had a good combination of expensive liquor and cheap wine in their belly, and they looked at each other and their their eyes sockets aligned, you know, like stars in the night and just big bang theory, you know what I'm saying. And uh, then I was conceived, all right. Imagine it was at the turn of the year. My birthdays a little later in the year, so you know, I got to incubate. So uh yeah, let's talk about my childhood. Um, what about much question? So we're this is this is generally a podcast about blockchain, but more generally, it's about how computers connect to each other. M hm. Now, what was your first interaction with computers back when you were a kid? There we go, that's throwed it down. So my first interaction with computers was I was four and a half, four years old, in between you know, preschool, in kindergarten. Uh, my pops built as a computer. Um he My my pops is still is soon to retire. But he's a software engineer for or telecommunications engineer things his official role for the government. And he's always been way into things like building. I think these days they call him maker spaces. But he always had something that he's always building something, always fixing something. Jack of all trades, master of a few of those trades, and he was always upgrading his computer. He upgraded his and then he gave us his old one. And um, I was about four, I think I was. It was running like Prodigy or something like that. It was just super duper old. It was running. Um this was right before Windows, right, And I just remember he was like my brother would have been eight and my brothers Uh this was this would have been nineteen eighty nine to right, and my brother was eight, So he was just like this is way wacker than my Atari, so I will never touch it. But since he was the older brother, he got to play Atari and the tendough I got to just look at some old ass computer and just like push buttons and like working through like MS doss and like just messing around with keyboard combinations until it would say something that wasn't error, you know. And that's how I figured out, like how to open up a folder from MS doss and stuff like that. I just like remember the combinations of stuff I was typing in, right, and that was my first computer, right, and then um, then when Windows, like whatever what was before Windows or ninety five came out? Was it just called Windows, like Windows three point one or something like? Anyways, I don't remember when Windows came out. Like my mind was like wow. I was...

...like, oh my god, this is so much easier than MS DOS. Like I can point this little mouse and like click on stuff and it's doing stuff. This is the stuff I always wanted to do. I didn't know what I was doing, right, and so that happened and shortly after right, that would have been um, yeah, So I've always had a computer, remember room, I've always played around with like you know when you have an older brother, they get to play the gaming system and they're like, come, watch me play this one player game and I'm like, no, it's it's whack. And so I would just play on the computer. But there was no play because like computer games kind of sucked. There was like the Solitaire, pinball, Yeah, I remember pinball. Mine sweep sweeper Yeah. For a child, mine sweeper is next level. It's like, I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm gonna click as fast as I can. Until it wasn't. I got older when I was like, oh these numbers mean something. Um, I just I just thought like the more numbers I have, the higher, the better I'm doing, and that that made some kind of intuitive sense. Um. Yeah, so I'll just play around on Windows, like go into like the control panel, going to the device manager, go into Like I was like, didn't know that I was sneakily teaching myself stuff that it's considered advanced computer use these days. Like if you go to a normal person, you're like, you need to go to the control panel. They're like, go to the go to the what what do? I hit the window button and I'm like Jesus Christ. They really they've been dumbing this down for some decades for everybody, I guess. So um. Yeah, So that was like that was my first interaction with computer was just having one in my bedroom, okay, from a very young age, and I think my pops. It was funny. My pops found a TV monitor in the gutter. Literally, like we went on a family walk and there was a TV monitor that somebody had just thrown into the into the like a CRT monitor. Yeah. Yeah, it was like an eight inch monitor. It was like it was a big and he tells my brother and me, he's like, I go pick up that monitor. And we're like, go pick up trash. And he's like, it's not trash. They just don't know what they're doing. And I was like, okay, So we're like walking for a mile carrying the CRT monitor. We put it on the dining rooms able he like cracks it open. He has like a masters and a degree that probably doesn't make sense these days, but I believe it's like elect electro mechanics something that it's just he knows electronics. He can build, he can fix chip sets and put chip sets together and stuff like that. Like he'll order bags of capacitors and just have him laying around. So anyways, he fixes the CRT monitor and that's our first monitor, right, And then that Christmas we asked for a TV, and instead of a TV, he found a TV tuner. This is this is really kicking it back to old school. He found a TV tuner in a dumpster and he mixed that and looked it up to our monitor. So our first TV was like an eight inch CRT with this big TV tuner underneath it. That you had to put a battery into work right in the battery we will go out like once a year. So it was very funny. Like when my friends came over there were like, hey, let's watch TV. And I'm like, well, turn that TV on up there. Then you gotta turn his TV tune on. Then you gotta tune into the right frequency, and you gotta make sure the battery is plugged in all the way. If the battery is not plugged in all the way, the TV is not gonna work. And then your friends, who are also dumb kids, look at you like, I think you're poor man. I think I think you're poor. Like we're living in the same neighborhood. But my TV works a lot easier than this. So anyways, so fast forward a few years. So you grew up with computers. Did that affect you choosing? Like what did you study in college? Jesus you said a few years. It's like a lot of years. So years. Um, So I'm not a good student. I've never been...

...a good student. I stopped being a good student in middle school. Right there was like a magic moment happened, right, And you know how you can remember sometimes you remember back like when was the moment that changed things? And it was the perfect moment when I got my first see in the seventh grade. Okay, and my pops at the time was commuting three hours away every week and coming back home. So when he saw my report card, like he didn't even fight it. Like I was like, man, I have a supreme ass whooping coming right now. I accepted it. I was like, yeah, when he sees this report card, I'm he's gonna he's gonna whoop my ass into dust. You remember what it was in? Uh? Yeah, I was in history, in Texas history, because who the funk cares about just Texas history. But anyways, according to Texans, sorry is good tangent. According to Texans, the United States would not exist if it were not for them fighting off Mexico. But what they don't realize is there was a whole lot of other people in that fight too, that just Texas. So like California gets no credit in Mexico, Arizona, those territories, they get no credit. It was just Texas that fought Mexico and now we get to exist as a country. So that's just a that's just the thing for the audience to know. So anyways, get my seed Texas history. Um Pops comes home late Friday night, obviously from driving half across Texas, and he's like, what's this about? And I was like, about grades, bro, that's what it's about. It's about it's about bad grades. It's I like, I'm ready for it. Like I think I had a pillow in my pants because I was ready for the whooping to come, because yeah, would I would get ready for it. And he was just like, look, now, you know what it takes to do the minimum, and you know what it's takes to be great, So the choice is yours. And I was like, perfect, this is perfect. If it's this easy to pass and do the minimum. This is great. This this frees up my whole afternoon and evening for video games and hanging out with my friends. If all I gotta do is that a little bit of work, right, It had the opposite effects. I think he thought he was like having a moment, but he just gave me more freedom than I needed as a child. And I was like, I'm gonna take those extra hours I would be studying and not and I'm gonna play play video games. I'm getting all one fifty two stars on Super Mario sixty four. Alright, I'm gonna perfect Wave Ray sixty four. Anyways, So I wasn't the best student, but I had an acumen for technical technical stuff and math um more so science than math. So you know, I was did well in those classes because they're naturally intriguing. And English are like, let's read a story about these kids that walk through a closet, and behind the closet is some goats that talk, and I'm like, this is some wax ship. But math and science was always interesting. Science, you know, teaches you how stuff works. Math teaches you the language of how that stuff works. So it just was a natural connection. So um. Fast forward to college. Um. I went to Texas Tech University. Shout out to Patrick Mahomes, Um, everyone else from there can kiss my ass um, and uh didn't do well. The pattern repeated all the way through. Did great in my science and math courses, did bad in my everything else courses. Um. You know, had just never been a good student ever. Um, but made it through and I ended up. I started as a mechanical engineering major. I...

...ended up changing to mathematics, and I ended up leaving Texas Tech with a bachelor's and math, a minor in English, a minor in Spanish, and a minor. And no, I didn't get the minor mechanical engineering, but I got pretty close. That's it. Um, that's my education on as far as I've gotten cool. And then and then how did you get into like I guess, the spaceholated stuff? Man? Well, first of all, I have to thank uh doctor Corey Petty for getting me into this space or at least peaking mind. No, there's no at least like if it were for doctor Petty or for Corey, I would not be in this I wouldn't care about it at all. Right, So Corey and I went to school together. Corey and I met during Halo two. I don't know what year that is, but the audience will google it. I don't know Halo two. We played in Halo two tournaments. We had Halo too fun, we had college fun. We you know, Corey had a house. It was a party house, a no way around it. There's a lot going on in those houses. He had two houses. One was a party house, the second one was a better party house. Right. Uh, we had a great time. Uh. Coryo was a better student than I was. In fact, when Corey and I met each other, we were in the same classes. But obviously he's got PhD behind his name and I do not. He's a much better student than I am. Uh. And honestly, just half the time he was teaching me ship in the class, I would just like look at him work, take mental notes of what was going on, and then go pass my tests. That's pretty much like I'll be asking questions like, so, what's going on? Is was multivariable calculus here? What's going on here? We're gonna do first? You know, we just worked together. I think he probably learned more by teaching me, and that's probably because you know, you learn more when you teach people. Corey has been my my friendly, uh my, my my best friend slash brother slash tutor for for meny a year now. Um so he got you into this. How okay? So we all lived in the party houses. I don't know why that's such a thing, but obviously, you know, it stuck in my head because we had a good time. I moved out of the house. I graduated. I was like, hey, guys, I've finished my stint. I'm going to go get a career or whatever. That wasn't even it. I was just moving out and going home. I think most that's what happened now. I remember my pop said very very recently had a severe heart attack. So because I was broke, instead of teaching in Lubbock, which was my plan, so I could continue living in the party house and just my my students would never know that I teached during the weekend. Rage On the weekend, I actually moved out of the house to go be home with my parents make sure my dad wasn't eating himself into an early grave, and my mom can handle things. So I went back and I had no intent of teaching. I literally applied to teach on a whim right, I know that's what it was. I was like, man, I need something to do because I can't just stay here and make sure my dad's eating. Right, that's not gonna pay the bills, Uncle Sam. And once I had a mistress named Sally May. She was knocking at the door for some money, right, So I just applied to become a teacher. I was teaching for about a year when Corey hit me up. And and Corey and I both have had an affinity for investing, right. We had each trade accounts. I won one small mom in the summer. We were...

...like trading pink sheet stocks. Like we were like, this one's gonna be a banger. It's gonna move from a tenth of apenity to a half a penny, and let me tell you something that's gonna buy us with a lot of kegs. And we were we were like all we were missing was like cigarettes in a coke cabin. And we were like in the pink sheets, we were almost Wall Street. We were in it in that little college house. We were logging in the E trade. We're looking at charts, we were trying to make sense of it. We're researching companies, but which, by the way, the same stuff that happens in crypto happens in the pink sheets. So I don't understand why people want to like act like this is new forums people talking that ship fake businesses. There was a business that was like supposedly in Lubbock. So I drove by that address on my way home to visit the parents one day and it did not exist. I was like, hey, guys, I think that pink sheet that we put all that money in is fake because this addressed there's nothing here. I'm here, I'm physically standing where this is supposed to be, and there's no there's no building here. That picture is fake. And I was like, okay. So that taught me a lot about investing that summer that like, hey, if you're not on the inside, you're you're not gonna get in on it. You're not. It's those stocks like coin based stocks like Facebook, that stuff. The people have their money in it, so long before it even hits Wall Street, it's over for you. It's over right, Like it's all just an inside game, and the trick is to to know enough people to get inside enough. And that's with any new investment anything. So um, we had this infinity for investing, and uh, we tried some stuff, didn't work out, hit a couple of licks on pink sheets. About a year after, he's like, hey man, like, I think he started mining light coin and he got really into I think he was mining like coin to flip it to bigcoin. And he calls me and he's like, hey man, there's this thing called bigcoin. Um, I think you should look into it. And he sends me the white paper. I read like the first two pages and then I'm like, uh, you know, I think my exact words were, I don't really know what you want me to do with this digital monopoly. If I want a monopoly money, I would go gut buy Monopoly board King, and I will play around with that. And he's like, all right, man, I started to be interesting. You know, you know how cool he is. He's not gonna like push something on you. He's not gonna be like, get involved by this ship. He's just gonna be like, hey man, that's pretty cool you should take a look at. And so months go by, and at the time he told me about it, I could have you know, I had saved some money in college from working. I could have bought a significant amount of bigcoin. I think the price was like sub three dollars, right, It was not very expensive at all. And then eight months go by and he calls me again and he's like, hey man, remember that bitcoin thing. And I was like, you're talking about that my notpoly money bullshit. And he was like, well, it's it's worth like a thousand dollars right now, nineties something like that, and it's going up. And I was like, and I just did the knack of math. I was like, okay, so missed the boat. Missed the boat, big tom. So then I revisited the white paper and I read it all the way through the second time, and um, you know, I just got a bachelors of math. I don't. I'm pretty sure everyone working in crypto now on the infrastructure level has, so they're doing math that I just would. It just would look like the the hieroglyphics in the movie star Gate. To me. I would just be like, oh, yeah, I see, I see you've got a summation sign there. I'm familiar. I see a grand samata. That's about it. Everything else I would just be like, that's a function I...

...need to look at for a month. But what I found fascinating about the white paper was it was using some of the principles that I had learned in undergrad in my like Basic Introduction to UM, real Analysis and Foundations of Algebra. UM. The more specifically on the Foundations of algebra was the small section that we had to learn about cryptography, about modular arithmetic, and my professor was really into modular arithmetic, and we spent some time on it, and I thought it was fun. And I've also I've used madulo in my life. I used it for when I recognize a pattern. I'll use modulo to build dashboards for for people clients. UM. But um. Nevertheless, I was like, oh, this is like the applied version of the stuff I just learned. And and in that class that we happen to learn about like cracking passwords and how long why it takes so long? Because these computers are just like brute force guessing these spaces of probability, like what is the password likely to be given? You know this amount of characters? Uh, per slot, I guess permentations and commonatorics. Yes, absolutely that. And when I was like, oh, yeah, like this is this is unhappable. This is there's gonna be infinity spaces forever. Um, this is obvious. These these um, these keys are obviously unique. And I was like everything just kind of clicked, like, oh, these are unique ones and zeros. That's pretty powerful to me. I was like, Oh, like this is if this is the first time we figured out how to make unique ones and zeros, I think that's pretty dope, right, um, And I was like, oh, this is obviously gonna be a big deal. So I don't think so It's a combination of things, right, And this is the way I feel most people get into crypto. The people that get passionately behind crypto are usually people that were kind of like myself, that have a tangential understanding and also are fiscally vulnerable. So what I mean by that is, um, you know, coming out of school being a teacher, after being an undergrad almost a decade and being a teacher, I'm looking at a mountain of loan debt and I was like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna be paying these loans forever, and then I'm going to hand them to my children when I pass and they will be thankful for it. Uh. So that's what I was looking at so I was like, I gotta find a way as a teacher to make enough money to pay back this triple digit loan debt that I have amassed for myself. I mean like six six figures six figures, sorry, six figures, not triple to six figures. Um, be an extra three digits there, right, So making what teachers make I at the time to make ends meet, I had to teach, I had to tutor for the district, and then when I was done to rooting for the district, I had tutor privately for a company, and then on the weekends I would tutor online. Right, So I technically have four jobs. So I was making a lot for a teacher, but I was really working hard four jobs at once, just just just tutor in kids all day every day, Um right, right. But I knew I had to make a lot of money or I was gonna forever be in debt. So the fiscal vulnerability I'm talking about is like, Hey, if this thing keeps moving like it's moving, Dad's gonna be able to pay off these loans that he's gonna have options. Right. So naturally, I'm not the kind of person that...

...invests in something and doesn't figure out what I'm investing, hence me taking a trip in the desert of Lubbock to see if this pink sheet company really existed, right, because I was like, they're talking a lot of ship on the internet, but I don't think they're real. And so UM I went. I started diving into bigcoin. Our slash bitcoin used to be useful. Um. There there was another bigcoin Talk, well Bitcoin Talk was Let's Talk Bitcoins the podcast. I think Bigcoin Talk was the forum. If I'm not mistaken, Pett, if you're listening, can you correct me on that whatever forum that's so to she was on. Um. I was just soaking it all in, right, just like understanding the hash rate. There used to be a website called bitcoin wisdom dot com where you could see the hash freight charts and would also connect the charts to the price. Bitcoin wisdom dot com is very vong term throwback for for you O G s and audience Bitcoin wisdom dot com and I learned all about hash rate difficulty, what that means, why it adjusts when it adjusts. Um just got really into it. I also found this website called Let's learn me a bitcoin dot com, which is just perfect UM, you know, if you if you want to be leagues beyond your peer and crypto and understand this stuff at a very foundational level, go to learn me a bit coin dot com. Um, maybe we should put it. Maybe you should put it up there, learn me good recommendation and put it out there. So anyways, Jesse and I went through that website and we had a great time with it. Um. But anyways, started learning how the technology works. UM, so I could be in it for the tech, you know what I mean? O kidding but not really. It's like once when it hits you about how awesome this stuff can be, it's like, holy crap, and it just absorbs you. UM. And I've seen that happen to several people since I've been in crypto, people that I've on boarded, They're like whoa, Like you can do this and you can do that, and well wait a second, didn't any debt? And I'm like, no, don't get to don't get too out of yourself with that any database talk really on back, really really on back. But you know, I got absorbed with it after that second introduction from Corey, and then Corey showed me how to mind like coin. I went to a party with all of my old high school friends because I was home and I was so absorbed with bitcoin. It's all I could talk about at the party. I was that guy at the party, just all my friends from high school. Mind you, we've been graduated for like a decade, right, so they had like have kids and stuff. They don't care. They've been working over they've been grinding already, they have, you know, received hairline flying back Gray's. They don't care. They're like, bigcoin. What I gotta go to soccer price three times a week? Bro, don't hear about your damn bigcoin. I was like, no, you don't. You don't get it, but you will. There was one friend there that got on the hype train with me. His name is Marcello. Y'all know Cello if y'all know me, um, And he was like, what's you're talking about money? And I was like, yeah, man, I'm talking about money. I'm talking about I think it could be worth a lot of money. And he said he's talking about money money. I was like, yeah, like in the bank money. No. The conversation wasn't like a William's Brothers skit um, but we got on board we put our money together and I had up Corey. I was like, Cory, I got a big pile of money. What do I do with it? He was like, you need to buy these video cards, these motherboards, buy all this stuff. You need to build a minor. And I do that, right. I get all these parts. And then I started building my minor and building my...

...computer and put it in my bedroom. And my pops naturally comes back into the picture. He's like, what's you building there? Are you winning? And I was like, I think I'm winning. And I told him what I was doing, and he was like, well, this is first of all, I want to tell you this is stupid. And I was like, what do you mean? And he was like, what is this computer is supposed to do? It doesn't have a CP This CPU is trash, it's all GPU. And I was like, yeah, dad, it's it's it's the script. It's like when you don't get it, you just don't. You're not cool, Like you're not hit. Like it's like when get hips the GPUs they're hashing. Look at the GPUs running at max. He's like, why are your GPUs running at max? They're not doing anything? And I was like no, they're guessing numbers. And he was like huh, And just like in true dad form, he's like, that's a really shitty computer, but I can make it better with you. So then we went out and we bought some metal from Lows and we built like a air free or sorry like not in case. We we basically welded a frame to an old computer case so we could keep the GPUs outside of the case the computer case, and then we fashioned a duct system so we could have the cool air from the air conditioner go straight into the graphics card and then the hot air come up above the system. So like my temperatures were amazing on my graphics card. We had four graphics cards in there. There were our t Corey might remember they are, I don't remember they are. They're big and yellow and loud, and they were in VideA. I believe, um righties are seven two eighties. We had four of them. They were alloud. Corey showed me how to hook it up, how to configure the minor, how to make it remotely talked to my phone so that I would get notifications if it went down, and I could just started like I would be in class and like all right, kids, so we're gonna talk about I saw some these right triangles. Give me a second and put my phone. Meanwhile telling the students you can't have your phone in class. I was like, just get I can have my phone. Do as I do, not as I say, and I hit the button to restart my miner and go back to the white board. And so anyways, we mind like coin. And you know when when you're a miner, you're thinking you're doing something, You're like, oh man, this is like coin coming into his wallet when that price goes up. Oh boy, lambos for everybody like you just have stupid young thoughts when when you know I was mine all that, like when this would have been back in like ow, Corey's holding up, what is there? It is? I don't know if that's the card, that's the card, that's the exact card. Okay he's nodding. Okay, Um, that exact card is in this computer right now, right now, it's allowing us to do this. There's no way, that's the way. There's no way you have an R seven to eighty in your desktop right now. Yeah I do, That's what I'm using right now. No way do you want me to prove it after the show. Wait, Corey, Corey, I'm watching you in the corner. Nod yes, if Corey, if he actually has an R seven to eight and he does, what the hell? All right? Because I don't even know what you know? What do you know that? I don't know? I just like thinking, I got a cool video card. That's it's it's it's it's old, but it's not like ancient. I remember when I was in college. I uh there was a there was a PhD candidate student doing chemical engineering and uh no sorry, chemistry, and he gifted me his fifty eight fifties radion and fifty fifties and I thought I was high, like doing some high performance computing back in the day. But those are the release states for that. I think is too THO and...

...nine. But yeah, that our night or that is really nice video card. To use spreadsheets, I'm good. I'm good at the spreadsheets. Let me tell you. I'm throwing functions out by memory with the parameters like in Google Sheets or Excel. That's my jam. I don't even know Google Sheets or Excel used GPUs. That's what I'm saying, Like, I don't use this thing. I don't play games with it. I don't do. I just couldn't sell it, and I was like, hey, I got some space in my computer. Let me just hook these wires up about and that's now. Now I got it in here. I played games on the PlayStation and I don't even really use it anymore for anything. Now. I know people in the CLAC would be like, why don't you mind quantum token and flip that into bbju token and then that into juju bes and I'll be like, because I'm not gonna do that. That's it's way you too much effort. Okay, So, so you got into crypto were the financial reasons initially, and my story is not too dissimilar because I jumped in for financial reasons because working as an engineer, I was not making anywhere near enough that I thought I would be making um and so I wanted more, Like I wanted more money. I wanted to understand why the world was the way it was, and my degree didn't, you know, basically come with more and anyway, so financial vulnerability is interesting that you bring up, because you know that was that was how I got into crypto as well. Um, but mine was more black market through video games. Right, So, like I traded beyond prices that were allowable in video game markets, and by trading those rare items, you have to look for ways in which you can kind of skirt the system, right, So you can you know, say the Steam market place limits items to four dollars. We'll say an item is to be charged to be to be valued at you know, two thousand dollars. How do you how do you transfer that amount of money? Right? Also, so, so the deal was you use a combination of bitcoin and keys and in game uh and in game items in order to kind of move those transactions. Anyway, long story short, Um, yeah, I I know you were a pirate. Wait no, that's not what that counts you were. I'm just I was just a trader, Like I felt like a black market trader, the savvy fella. That's all. You were savvy. So like, it's it for me? Like I you gotta say allegedly, by the way, No no, no, I mean it's like everybody every it's not illegal. Um. So, I guess video games and crypto in terms of like fake money, I didn't see it as fake money. I saw it as real money in a digital economy. Which is exactly what I've been doing since I was nine, playing RuneScape and using the Grand Exchange, which is essentially a stand in for a real exchange. So so like crypto made a lot of sense to me as soon as I came across it. It's just I didn't come across it earlier because I have no idea. I didn't have a Cory to send me the bitcoin white paper. That's hey, if you added if you would have had a Corey in your life, and that's I've always made it a point to not be the smartest person. When you're the smartest person in the room, you need to figure out how to get into a new room. And I have had the luck of having best friends in college Corey PhD in quantum physics in chemistry, which is like this motherfucker's aunt. Man, he's fucking pim. That's him. And then his our other friend was sucking he's literally I think he's building a quantum motor right now or something, or was building a quantum motor, but decided to take a break from the hard work to just like be a be a consultant in quantum physics,...

...because you know, if you know as much if you know so much quantum physics, you can consult it. Then, so me with my bachelor's of math, I was like, hey, guys, I can I know the ship out of some algebra? Bro? Like if I mean that's my ship? Like not, like that's pretty much where where it stopped right, And so I was never the smartest person in the room. But then one thing I observed, one thing that I think cripples crypto, and this is gonna hit Cory in the heart. As I I spent many a night being surrounded by highly educated people, and one thing that really highly educated people love is winning a debate. And then on top of winning a debate, being right and winning the debate, it gets intense, like the arguing gets to a point and I could never I never had a dog in the fight. And most of these arguments I would just be sitting listening and I was like, damn, these guys love to debate. They love to go back and forth anything. Any topic was a debatable topic or anything like I mean, any movies, shows, and the debate wasn't like hey is this show good? It would be like, let me tell you why this show is better? And all has to do with the cinematography and the in the angles of the shading, and I'm like, what the you guys love it? You guys love it. So in crypto, I see that a lot. I see that a lot. In Crypto, I see everyone is more excited about the date and the rightness than just doing stuff, getting stuff done and willing to be wrong. More stuff gets done by people who are willing to be wrong than everyone wanting to be right and go with the way. To do something, you gotta just do stuff right. Um that's a lesson that I had to learn, and I think crypto needs to learn that lesson. And I know you don't just do stuff when money is on the line, but we see, we see our government do it all time. They're just throwing ship at the wall with money every day. So it's like, might as well fuck it, just just do it. Let something right and if it doesn't work out, at least you have a track record to show we tried this, didn't work. Now we're trying something else. Can we have some more money? So so, so what happened? So, like all these debates, did they manifest themselves into maybe like a podcast about crypto at some point? No, no, no, how the so that how the Big Quin podcast came about. It's a very funny story. I think I've told it a few times on different shows and stuff. Cello my friend and I we got really deep into crypto. But he always like if Cello was on the surface level, I was like below surface cories at infrastructure level. It's always been like that. He got tired of me talking to him about crypto, right, and one day he was like, dude, you talk about this so much, I'm gonna quit my other business. He had a business called Man It's funny. He actually had the largest anime website for like Western people like he is called like Japan Cinema, Cinema and Cinema. He built that and uh, it was crazy. He grew to a point where he had like writers writing for him and like he was like, yeah, I just got really into Japanese media and build a website about it. And he was like, I'm gonna stop doing that, and I want to do this crypto thing with you. Because even him, he's very sensitive to things that when they're going to be a big deal. He's in marketing, he's in that arena, so he like knew he saw Crypto was like, oh, this opportunity to make money. Yeah. He was like this is gonna be a big deal. And he was like, I want to make a thing with you about Crypto. No, didn't even start with that. I started I want to make something with you. We started out making a board game. It was great. It's called Stockpile. We designed all the characters, we wrote all the rules. We had somebody looking at the balancing of it,...

...and then we gave it to like somebody who's like an expert gamer, and they tore it to shreds like they were like, yeah, Cones of Dunshire, that was not the game. They ripped off that game, Christian not not yes if it was, and it never ended like we made that game. It took us a year and a half of while we were minding. We were making this game called Stockpile. It's going to be so good. God, it was gonna be good. We even built like an Indiogo campaign. But after we got ripped to shreds, we just gave it up because that's what you do children, you quit. So anyways, no, we one night we were getting a little bit toasty and Shella was like, we should do a podcast. What are we gonna do it about? And I was like, podcast was that you're nerdier than I am. What's the podcast? He's like, you just said what's a podcast? I was like yeah, like at the time I had heard of it, like it wasn't even something that was on my mind. It's also it's kind of interesting because the same time I heard about pot. No, I didn't say what's a podcast? I said what about And he said, what about bitcoin? You can talk about that all day? You talk about it so much you made me want to sell you my minor, Like I hate it actually because of you. And I was like, okay, well let's uh, let's talk about bitcoin. And then we sat for like an hour trying to think of a show and we were like the block cast, blocks on blocks, uh, like just all kinds of names we're ratting off. And then he like it was like what about the bitcoin podcast? And I was like does it exist? And he was like, click click click, no, it doesn't. Nobody has it. We bought it like instantaneously. We were like are you serious? Like who doesn't There were four podcasts at the time, and they didn't think of the bitcoin podcast. We were like, oh Jesus s so we get it. We get all excited and he's like, well, we just bought it, so we gotta do something. I was like, if you make the website, I will buy all the audio equipment. And he made the website in like an hour. I was like, oh, that's easy to do, and he was like, yeah, make a website. It's not hard at all. I was like, well, they really make it seem like a big deal. But anyway, so he made the website. He's like staring at me. He's like, you're gonna buy the stuff on a teacher salary. I was like, I think I feel like a bit off more than that. You that's a lot of stuff. So I was like, fuck it, let's do it. We went on Amazon, put all the audio equipment on a credit card, right because I was like, well, I'm not definitely not spending my savings on this. I'm just gonna spread out this cost, put microphones, all the stuff to hang up to mics, went to hobby lobby. Built my first soundproofing. Oh my god, I still have it. Like I built soundproofing out of styrofoam and like wires from hobby Lobby and like hooked it to my mike and it just like folded around my mind. It just looked terrible, but I sounded great. But anyways, um, we got all high ready to go, and before the first episode, I was like, we need a third guy and then Sellow was like, I've already got the music. It says just two guys, and I was like, who cares. Nobody's gonna care, and so so I called Corey or Cello calls Cory. He's like, we gotta get Corey. And it's a very crazy story. I'll Cello news Cory. But anyways, Cello calls Cory or hits him up on Internet talks. There's so many messaging things that he hits him up some Facebook message or something. I don't know. He's like, hey man, we're doing a podcast. You want in on that? And Corey was like, I'll listen to it. And then Cello comes back to me like tail tucked and he's like, um, I don't think Corey wants to do it, And I was like,...

...what doesn't make sense. Corey loves this ship. And then I called Corey and like, hey man, what's up man, We're doing this podcast? You in or what and he's like, what do you mean in, And I'm like, do you want to do the podcast with us, like be a host? And he's like, oh that's what Cello meant. Oh yeah, sure, I'll do it. And then I called Cello back when he's in He's like, oh, okay, well I tried. I was like all right. So then we got three hosts and we started the podcast, and our first show was garbage because we were at Cello's computer desk. He was on that side and I was on this side, and we're literally just talking into each other's microphones. So it was like quadruple quadruple. It was terrible. And we got this god, we got this dude from Africa, Cello find a guest man. We got this dude from Africa who was like spearheading bitcoin in Africa like he wanted, like it was obvious to him. And that's something that makes crypto obvious to a lot of people that aren't uh spoiled like us in America and in other places in the world. Africa, they don't have money, they can't trust their government at all, like we could trust our government. I hate It's a lot of news. There's a lot of bad news to hear for people that listen to the show. But in the comparison of good governments and bad in America, were on the good side because in Africa they just come in and take your stuff and they're like, what are you gonna do about it? Oh, you want to do something now, you're dead right. That happens in a lot of places in Africa. So anyways, we interview this guy from Africa and that was our first episode. I can't remember his name, sorry guy, it was seven years ago. So but anyways, I hope that answers your question. Yeah, so, okay, so you started a podcast because you and Cella were your spitballing ideas. You went through a board game that didn't work. Uh, then he came up with the idea of what about a podcast? And then you guys sourced Corey and then you started going. So all those years, when was that back in yep? That all happened early. That all happened like March, no April May, Yeah, so a month not to get going. Alright, So so in all the years, I guess, uh, what has been your experience from going from complete novice to I guess whatever you would consider yourself. I think you call yourself g pp of of I don't know level. Okay, there he goes, that's the highest tier. Okay. So um, So what's been your takeaway from just the tech in general and what's your like are you still are you still interested in it financially? Are you still interested in it from a technology perspective? Like, where's your understanding at now? That's a very good question right now. From a financial aspect, you know, I accomplished my goal getting at a student loan debt um and then some right I I lucked in so early that you know. Now I have a savings that your builds on itself, and uh, I have crypto that builds on itself when it comes to value, and those are good things to have in your hip pockets in life in general. So I think financially, I feel smooth right to that. To that end, I feel good, like, yeah, accomplished that. I'm not like SBF rich now kidding, he's not rich, he's broke, he's going to jail. But but I'm I'm good, you know, doing good there Now. I'm I'm leaning in on trying to learn as much as I can with the time that I have you know, because life has also happened in seven years to understand what is good tech and what is not good tech in...

...this space. UM, with new tech and this is any new technology. I think any new technology is so surprisingly close to magic that it invites in magicians. And I hate magicians, like they're just it's fake assholes sitting up there with their stupid as tricks doing stupid ass ship with mirrors and foldable things, making us think that they're doing something magic. And it's just like you're that's stupid, You're stupid, like UM. And it's so close to magic, it invites magicians that come in and take the things from it that are valuable and twist and turn them and try to capitalize from it. What are the things that are valuable? Mm hmm, that's a great question. I think the things that are valuable are being able to have custody over your own money. UM. I think that's a very important thing that I think the powers to be would love for us never to have custody of our own value and our own money. Uh. I think another powerful thing UM is um. There was at one point in time and crypto was like be your own bank. Obviously that's a very, very difficult ask of anyone, but it does have some things that touch on things that need to happen, which is people need to have an understanding of the things they need to be responsible for in the world that we live in, digital footprint being one of them. How you're interacting with the digital world. That's a new responsibility that humans need to encumber and stop leaving that to people. It's our reality now we're headed that way. I think crypto teaches the behaviors of how to interact in that, how to how to how to live with that, which I think is very important is what this technology provides. Um. I've also become very fascinated with the history of money since this the whole thing started. I think it's interesting that I think we're gonna go back. I think it was gonna be a circle, right. I think there was a civilization at one point that kept the entire town's money on a disc and the longer your line was, the more valuable you were. And it's gonna be funny is that that's kind of like a distributed ledger. Like it's public. Everybody can see which wallets are the biggest and the longest. Um, they don't necessarily know who that is, but they know that that wallet is very valuable and it's a global communal disk, uh if you will. So that's how everybody shares the same length block chain, right, Well, that that's that's not what I mean. I'm speaking in the end. I'm like going in and out of the analogy. You had a disc with lines on it, the longest line would be the most valuable line. Whoever has like a lot of larger large ut x I is it if it's bitcoin? And whoever has the most U t x o s, Which nobody's going to the club and making U t xos rain, right, So there's there's obviously somebody there's gotta be a link between this crypto and like real life stuff, right like, right now, that is such a powerful statement and people are just gonna brush it off. But if you can't go to the club and make it rain ut x o s, crypto ain't taken off. Let me tell you something. We gotta make that a reality. We got to. Uh So, um, those are the parts of the valuable of Those are the parts that are valuable about crypto to me, right, And I think people take advantage, and it's easy to take advantage because this technology, like I said, it is so dangerously close to magic. You get your magicians like SPF that rolling and said, Hey, I know how to do that wizardry, so just trust me to...

...be your wizard. And then people were like, wait, is sayt it Okay? I guess, I guess Gandalf, I guess you can be my wizard if you know how that stuff works. Right, So we tried to make it rain apt We actually did try to make it rain, but see Corey, that's not raining ut x O s it was gonna make dollar bills rain onto this trooper ah with bitcoin. Um, that's a different story. That's a different personals for a different time, honey. So anyways, UM, I hope the answer your question. That's that's why I think this stuff is valuable. So what do you What do you currently do? And I guess do you want to spread the news about what's going on behind the scenes, behind the scenes like what I currently do with my job every day and how you're pivoting potentially from that. Yeah, So my current job every day, I'm CEO of these four instruction companies, which means that I Um, just try to make sure that we can. We can do the most stuff and with spending the least amount of money every day. That's what I do in a nutshell. How many actions can I get done the cheapest, sorry, the least sorry let me put that back, the most effective use of moneys to get that stuff done. Um. But we are in talks for me to pivot on into crypto full time, which it would be different for me. I finally feel like cryptos in the spot where I can take that risk. I tried taking that risk in and it just ended up in heartache for me. Uh, you know, not not being able to work in crypto full time. But I think it's mature enough where I can. We're trying to set up UM like I don't know what would you call I see like just to show oh, for can we name drop? Is it okay to name drop? Yep, you got thumbs up. We got a thumbs up to name drop. So a a podcast for status, um, which if I could be candid? Can I be candid? I mean you should always be comes up. Status doesn't do the best job of giving everyone their status, so you got another thumbs up for that. So I will work in that irony and try to make it so that Status can do a better job audibly and maybe visually podcasting sake to tell everyone their status what's going on in status. Status is one of the most profound companies in the space. But you wouldn't know that, and maybe that's a good thing. To me, that's a bad thing, But I think at some point there are people that need to know at the right times, and those people aren't even hearing right. So that is how it come to Crypto full time. And it's gonna be a fun adventure. It will be a definite change of pace and it won't be an overnight transition, but it will be a good change of pace from construction, which is an interesting industry. Um, I'm excited. Yeah, so um yeah. Well, let me let me ask you Corey's favorite question. Do you have any questions that I didn't get to that you may have wanted me to ask? M hm m hmm. Let me think no, no, Um, I was hoping you would ask me what my favorite uh podcast to make? Was? Okay, what is your favorite podcast? What was your favorite podcast to make? It was definitely what the header?...

It wasn't really don't lie to me, don't you know? It was? It was so much fun because it's just I like to enjoy myself, as you could tell. And we did not take that show seriously. Even though we were like giving headlines. People would ask us, They're like, hey, since you guys were talking about the news because you because you just read the news and that's it. And I was like, what is this NPRU out of here? I don't care what sorry, excuse, I don't have to use myself this podcast. I was like, if you want the news, go to NPR, but they're not talking about crits. You gotta come here. We're gonna talk about that headline and then we're gonna say a bunch or whatever we want to say. And that was I had a great great time doing with that. Um, it was fun. Well, we can resume that dynamic with flash Ash so we are. We're even better produced with Christians. So yeah, she's laughing. Alright. So I have one last double question for you, okay, and that is for someone looking to upgrade their kitchen countertops from lambing it and being budget count us, what tips would you give in terms of materials, where to go, how to negotiate the best help deal. Is there anything you can share as an insider? Yes, actually a lot um. First of all, it depends on the application. Lemon. It can be outdoors too. If you put lemon outdoors, I feel sorry for how much money you've wasted. But now let's talk about if it's for a let's just run through. Let's just run through the materials, all right. Okay, so the longest paying for your book is going to be courts, courses and engineered stones. Engineered it's not engineered stone. We're not God. But we take a bunch of stones and some nice resin and some technology and we make pretty patterns and we call that courts. It comes in two centimeters and three centimeters and some millimeters as well. Wall cladding is what they call it. But courts is if you wanted to last really long and be trendy for a pretty long time, all right. And it is natural stone. And granted is one of my favorite. Granted is also inexpensive. Granted grade A grant it is what they call it. Um. It kind of just looks like sedimentary rock. So the closer you get to igneous rock, the more expensive the stone is. Okay, what is igneous rock just quickly. Damn, bro, you're talking. You're taking it back to grade school science here, or we're just like the last of what you've been doing right before you jump in full time in crypto, and then your brain's gonna have to like hold a whole bunch of different information. We're doing install and plumbing, which is interesting, but um, alright, So sedimentary rock is like you know, back in grade school science, Like it just looks like a bunch of different rocks glued together. God does it, and we took what God did and slashed from ship on top of making shiny. We're done in your house, alright. Igneous rock is that stuff that God makes under like high pressure, and it's basically like cool down lava. So it's a little bit closer to the hot stuff in the mountain or in a volcano, I guess. Or was it more or something in terms of composition. Uh, I would say no, not more homogeneous. The more homogeneous you get usually the cheaper the stone. Right, So it's got a lot of different stones and it's usually more expensive. Some of our stuff has dolomite in it. And every time I'm like, my team is talking about oh that's got more dolomite in it. I'm like, all right, now I got more dolomite. So so anyways, I didn't even know it was a thing until I started working here. I thought it was just a pimp from the seventies. But anyways, um, yeah, So like the more varied rocks that hasn't it And the deeper they gotta dig into the mountain, the more expensive it's going to be. Now, the thing, I'm ten seconds, wrap it up, ten seconds. I have some editing on it. I can't working to that pressure. I need time. Um. By...

...the way, granted is formed under pressure, so don't kidding. Uh So, anyways, let's say that I will say this because I don't want to give too many insider tips even though nobody's listening to the show. Um, there's a lot of leeway when it comes to negotiating price. Okay, anything that's naturally made from the earth and then is marked up to oblivion to give back to you, there's leeway to negotiate price, okay. Right, So it's it's the cost to get it out is very cheap machinery. The biggest cost is shipping, right, So you can negotiate price and depending upon when you go in the year. Usually if you go in the cooler times, you can negotiate that price a little bit better because nobody does construction in the cold times unless they've had a plan for a long time, right, So people's backlog of work tends to go down in the winter, so you can start asking for better pricing. So around now Christmas time early next year. Yes, And if you flash that cash, you're gonna get some nice though, because cash is very powerful. Like I said, you can make it rain. So if you go with somewhere and you're like, check this out, I got three thousand dollars, you can maybe be able to negotiate a little bit better than if you're just like, mm, I don't know, it's a little bit expensive. It was a little bit expensive. We're gonna be like if it's too expensive, get the funk out, all right, Like sorry, that's not what we do. That's bad salesmanship. That's it. That's all I can go on. But I know we're running out of time, so well, thank you d for being on the show, and I appreciate it. Thank you for having me, And we're out.

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